Assisi-Aftermath and Controversy

I just received Robert Sungenis' 4 Cd collection Assisi; Interfaith Prayer Meetings. I have only listened to 2 1/2 CDs, but so far, good defense of Tradition and against the strange and unheard of flirtation with syncreticsm.

James Likoudis' response and Sungenis' rebuttal are particularly interesting. In the early 1980's, my parents helped to found a CUF chapter after heresy split in 2 our parish. Likoudis was a guest in our home and stayed with use. We talked, supped and shared stories. My parents to this day still have fond memories and well wishes of Likoudis. Blogspot is for some reason not allowing for colors and pictures at present, will add if possible in future.

He makes some odd comments that I like to comment and and some thoughts.

1. Loyal Catholics must never rebuke the Pope

CR- If we are never to rebuke the Pope, how is he to remain on the narrow path (1) to life, as he is human and subject to sin-especially with the pressure he is under and the Devil kicking hard against him(2).

As Father Corapi stated, in his talk Form Your Conscience, Vote Your Conscience(3) "if the sin is privte, confess it in private, if the sin is public, it must be dealt with publicly".

Praying alongside pagans, allowing them to practice their false religions and their false Gods, as Paul warns us, are really demons (4). Stayed tuned, again, as I am unable right now to download pictures. The pagans affored food, incense and animal sacrifices on Assisi's holy ground and even on Church property. Possibly, even inside churches.

As pastor of the Universal Church, the Pope is responsible to safeguard and protect Holy ground, not invite sacriledge into the Churches. Many argue that he did not tell them to do what they did. This is a naive and obfuscating tactic. If you ainvite someone into your home to pray, they will pray as they know and how they know. A Buddhaist is not going to break into a Rosary.

If the Pope were caught, in public, committing some other sin, say theft, are we then to pretend that it did not happen and write polemics against those that shine a light and call for penance?

I have seen anti-Catholic websites that have plastered the pictures from Assisi and other events, showing the Pope receiving a "blessing" from witch doctors and Aztec "priestesses". Their caption? Ah-ha, Jack Chick was right!. JP2 is a anti-Christ trying to bring about world religion. He is Mystery Babylon.

Now, do we publicly stand up or tuck our tails, not wanting to rock the boat? OF the 9 eays to sin, one if flattery, one is silence and the others:

By counsel
By command
By consent
By provocation
By concealment
By partaking
By defense of the ill done (5)

Again, if the sin is public, it must be dealt with in public, especially as souls are at stake, not only of indifference but falling into Protestantism.

The arguement that the Pope is beyond reproach in personal conduct and scandalous activity flies in the face of Paul, who upbraided Peter (who was Pope at this time) (6).

After Peter was named the Rock of the Church, Jesus upbraided Peter in front of the others.


2.Rebuke, if any, should be in Private

Again, the action was public and worldwide. It needs to be taken care of that way, least we participate in the sin and let others think wrongly of us. Hiding in private or in the dark is a sign of guilt or that of sinners (7).


3.Preserving the Image of the Pope is Better than the Truth

As noted above, his image with Protestants, the most likely to win over to the True Church, took it on the chin as Eveangelicals, Fundamentalists and others see the debacle in Assisi and other areas. They question and attack us for this, we would be more respected standing up for the truth and calling the Pope to repentance or even, stopping these events from ever happening. Speak the truth(8).


4. The world is against the Church, we must not infight

As noted above, we have far less credibility now, what with the priest abuse scandal and the images that have come out of Assisi. I first learned about it from a Catholic-Church-is-mystery-Babylon site. imagine what would happen if I were a lukewarm Catholic, not supernaturally protected by the Holy Spirit in Baptism/Confirmation. Imagine if I were a typical Joe Six Pack, what would I beleive then? I have talked to enough people to know what they are saying. Pre-V2, we had mass conversions, now mass attacks. But trying to hide sin, we have exploded it on ourselves.

We are not to pray with non-believers, esp if they invoke false gods and practicing meaningless or even satanic practices. The Pope spreading out cucumber peels to the snake god is a prime example. Hearing him state that others are seeking God in their own way, WITHOUT Christ is in contrast to Blessed Pope Pius IX (9):

11. The Church not only ought never to pass judgment on philosophy, but ought to tolerate the errors of philosophy, leaving it to correct itself.
15. Every man is free to embrace and profess that religion which, guided by the light of reason, he shall consider true.
16. Man may, in the observance of any religion whatever, find the way of eternal salvation, and arrive at eternal salvation.
17. Good hope at least is to be entertained of the eternal salvation of all those who are not at all in the true Church of Christ.
21. The Church has not the power of defining dogmatically that the religion of the Catholic Church is the only true religion.
77. In the present day it is no longer expedient that the Catholic religion should be held as the only religion of the State, to the exclusion of all other forms of worship.

After teh meetings, I have yet to hear of mass conversions to Christ, a re-uniting of schismatics and heretics. They went home and continued to practice outside the Church, feeling even more empowered that the Pope, the Rock ,the new Eliakim, gave them his blessing in his actions, his lack of Gospel preaching and his full cooperation.

Let us continue to pray for the late Holy Father JP2. let us not continue to cover and lie for him. He, like all men, can sin and fall short. His pontificate is forever marred by the scandals, the lax discipline and Assisi. I have many fond nad happy memories of JP2, the title "great" is not one of them. Likoudis and others need to stop the Papal Idolotry, putting JP2 and others on a pedastal all white and clean (10)


Reference:
1. Mt 7:13-14; Lk 13:24
2. Acts 9:5; Acts 26:14
3. http://www.fathercorapi.com/
4. 1Cor 10:20
5. http://fisheaters.com/lists.html#20
6. Gal 2:11-15
7. Ps 9:30, Ps 16:12, Ps 80:8, Jer 23:24
8. Mt 22:16, Jn 5:33, Jn 6:14, Jn 8:32, Jn 8:44, Jn 8:45, Acts 26:25, Rom 1:18
9. Syallabus of Errors (http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9syll.htm)
10. Paraphrase of Mt 23:27

More Diabolical Disorientation in Portugal

Portugal Will Keep the Faith and Legalize Abortion?
Cardinal Policarpo Dropping the Ball Again!

The country visited by Our Lady of Fatima—Portugal—risks becoming an abortion mill like so many other “Catholic” countries in Europe. On October 19, 2006, the parliament ratified the proposition of the new socialist government of Jose Socrates to introduce a referendum for abortion on demand until the 10th week of pregnancy.

Until now, abortion is tolerated in Portugal only in cases of rape, congenital malformation of the baby, and serious danger for the mother's life. Already in 1998, a similar referendum had been organized, with a very narrow majority (50.07 %) voting against it, and with a record rate of abstention: 68.11%.

This new referendum could be held as early as in January 2007, if the Constitutional Court and the Presidency pronounce themselves in favor of it, which is yet to be determined.

At the same time, the Church is faltering in this fight. The cardinal patriarch of Lisbon, Cardinal Jose de Cruz Policarpo (responsible for the infamous interfaith meetings at Fatima in 2003), has just recommended abstention (not voting on it) to the undecided voters. The question of abortion should not be, according to him, a religious question, but only one of fundamental ethics. "I don't make any recommendation to voters", declared the Cardinal. According to him, the Church shouldn't lead the campaign for this referendum: "It should be especially the physicians and family fathers who lead the way."


More and more, the victories of abortion proponents in Europe are due to the lack of courage on the part of the shepherds of the Church, who, in general, don't dare defend the life of babies any more, even if some bishops here and there still do. Opposition to abortion has actually become a source of division within the Church when it should be a unifying factor. If the Christians were standing united against the massacre of European babies, there would be no abortion in Europe.

Will Pope Benedict XVI find the courage to remedy this catastrophic situation?

Malta-Shining light in Darkness

CR- Good article from NOR, read and enjoy. Anyone with immigrating information and job info, let me know.

(flag of Malta)
Contrasts in Christendom: Red Lights in Amsterdam, Neon In Malta

October 2006By Thomas Basil
Thomas Basil entered the Catholic Church in 1996. He resides in the Archdiocese of Baltimore with his wife and six children.

It is sunset in Bugibba. Small tourist hotels and shops crowd a Mediterranean boulevard teeming with holiday-minded Europeans. Most are surely unaware that their vacation spot ranks a full chapter in the New Testament, Acts 28. In A.D. 60 a shipwreck here changed this island forever. The Church of St. Paul's Bonfire now stands in the boulevard's median strip. Here a serpent tried to strike down the Apostle Paul after he was cast ashore on Malta.

Malta is a remnant speck of Christendom off the coast of a post-Christian western Europe. Malta is home to 365 Catholic churches, roughly one for every 1,000 residents. Of her 400,000 citizens, 98 percent profess Catholicism and, more significantly, 85 percent attend Sunday Mass. The national flag is the feudal eight-point Maltese cross. Malta's state university trains future doctors and engineers as well as future priests. Public schools teach Catholicism as a required subject. Political debate is not over a woman's "right" to abort, but over a couple's "right" to divorce. Malta quaintly outlaws both modern liberties.

Before arriving in Malta, my itinerary took me to Amsterdam, where liberties flourish. In her Red Light district, prostitutes in underwear pose in storefront windows in shops directly opposite an obsolete medieval cathedral. Paid by credit card, prostitutes ply their trade shielded from onlookers only by a curtain pulled across their street-level window. Their professional status is secured by a Dutch labor union for "sex workers." Other Amsterdam sights included its airport's "meditation center," which holds a Sunday "multi-religious" service in a "chapel" devoid of any cross, but with a large arrow on the floor showing the direction to pray toward Mecca; and the suburban Amsterdam parish near my hotel where an elderly nun tallied Mass attendance for me as "about 15 on Saturday night; on Sunday about 100.

"Malta's equivalent to Amsterdam's Red Light district is an area known as Paceville. It too is jammed with passersby in search of a good time. But absent are store windows crammed with either prostitutes or obscene sex toys. Instead, its stores include souvenir statues of St. Padre Pio and ceramics of famous Maltese churches. Paceville's most provocative storefront has shelves filled with penis enlargement, breast enhancement, and other hedonistic potions. A neon sign blazes the shop's name: "Made in America."

Malta's Paceville is probably the world's only nightclub zone with a Eucharistic Adoration chapel. Founded by an Augustinian priest named Fr. Hillary, it is called The Millennium Chapel. The chapel's exterior mixes a multi-colored neon sign reading "WOW -- Wishing Others Well," a bronze sign of St. Augustine's famous quote, "Our hearts are restless O Lord until they rest in thee," and statuary of a pregnant woman, a weary businessman, an alcoholic, and a rebellious child at the door. Inside you meet the risen Christ painted in a rainbow of pastels on a triangular canvas. From the aqua-colored monstrance to the background music of waterfalls and birds, the chapel is a rare thing in Malta, an architecturally modernist church.

Open until 2 AM nightly, the Millennium Chapel hosts a 9:30 PM Saturday night Mass for the party crowd, plus a bookstore, a game room, a food pantry, counseling rooms, and a television lounge. A volunteer staff of 100 runs it all. During my visits I always saw young Maltese taking a break from the nightlife, many kneeling before the Blessed Sacrament, behind which the scheduled adorers of an older generation kept watch. It is a remarkable sight.

Many public transit buses in Malta lack doors, and nothing keeps the unsteady passenger from tumbling out except the watchful eye of God, seen in ceramic figurines of Jesus and Mary above the driver. Prayer cards of the Sacred and Immaculate Hearts, or a banner reading "Trust in God," adorned other buses but did not prevent drivers from cheating me more than once with too little change in the unfamiliar Maltese lira.

The hand of Providence seems to have guided not only Malta's bus system, but its very geography as well. Not far beyond where St. Paul shipwrecked begins a coastline of sheer cliffs. Had he hit land slightly west, there would have been no survivors. In the capital city of Valetta is the Church of St. Paul Shipwrecked, which depicts in sumptuous baroque murals every event of his life from the Bible. On the feast day of the shipwreck, February 10, its larger-than-life statue of St. Paul preaching is processed through city streets. The statue also was processed in 1798 in divine supplication as Napoleon's invasion fleet approached, and in 1960, when Malta celebrated the 1,900-year anniversary of St. Paul's arrival.

On one altar is enthroned a silver forearm encasing bones from the Apostle's hand. Ancient wax-sealed parchments allege its authenticity. Another altar holds a three-foot-high marble pillar topped by a silver sculpture of a severed head. It was on this pillar that St. Paul was beheaded. In 1818 Pope Pius VII bequeathed it to the Shipwreck Church in gratitude for parishioners' heroic service during an outbreak of the plague.

It is worth comparing the state of Christendom circa 1818 in the lands cleansed of relics by the Reformation. Lutheranism in German seminaries was hot with higher criticism claiming the Bible was unhistorical mythology. Anglicanism in Britain was beginning its theological drift that in a mere two centuries crowned an openly homosexual bishop in the U.S. Calvinism in New England had replaced Christ with Unitarianism. Yet in Maltese Catholicism circa 1818, New Testament relics were showcased in churches that portrayed New Testament stories as both spiritual and historical realities.

Valetta has 38 churches within its walls. Thirty-seven are Catholic. One is an Episcopal cathedral left over from British rule; nearest that altar are inscribed not saints' names but those of British ships that kept Malta supplied during the Nazi siege of World War II and a sort of relic -- a letter from England's Queen Mother. It was a visible reminder that non-Catholic churches typically trace back to a single nationality, and lack a trans-cultural broadness.

The most prominent Christians in Maltese history after St. Paul are the religious order today known as the Knights of Malta, founded in 1070 as the Sovereign and Military Order of the Knights Hospitaller of St. John of Jerusalem. It is the fourth oldest religious order still extant in the Catholic Church. Its motto has remained unaltered since 1099, Tuitio Fidei et Obsequium Pauperum -- "to defend the faith and to serve the poor."

The Knights initial role of hospitals for Catholic pilgrims evolved into military functions during conflicts with Islam, and the Knights became a strong fighting force. The Order was composed of hereditary noblemen from all portions of Europe. Its Grand Master might hail from Portugal, Germany, Spain, Italy, or England, although most were in fact French.

The Knights quit Jerusalem in 1291 when Islam conquered. They next took the Greek island of Rhodes as headquarters, and rebuffed four major Moslem assaults until a six-month siege in 1522, when they surrendered on Christmas Eve to Turkish Sultan Suleyman the Magnificent, who allowed survivor Knights to depart unmolested. In 1530 Holy Roman Emperor Charles V bequeathed Malta to the Knights as their new naval homeport, their navy then being one of the best in the world.

The Knight's worst defeat came not from Islam but from the French Revolution, which confiscated the income of their French estates, and whose Napoleonic fleet ignored the Knights' neutrality and seized Malta in 1798. The Knights reconstituted in 1834 as a Catholic charitable society. Membership today consists of 11,000 Knights and Dames living in 54 nations. The Order maintains diplomatic relations with over 90 nations and has permanent observer status at the United Nations. Its territory consists of one building in Rome. It is something akin to the Red Cross, as it runs hospitals; and somewhat akin to a nation, in that uniformed peacekeeper Knights serve in Bosnia. As for Malta, the British occupied the island in 1803, dallied with returning it to the Knights, but instead made it a colony until granting independence in 1964.

The Knights' noblest moment came during what is still known as the Great Siege of Malta. In 1565 the Turkish Sultan besieged Malta with a fleet of 373 vessels and 40,000 men. Opposing him were a meager 500 Knights, 400 Spanish troops, and 4,000 Maltese men. Despite the hopeless odds, 70-year-old Grand Master Knight Jean Parisot de La Valette outwitted the Sultan's commanders and forced a Turkish retreat. At one point all captive Christians were decapitated by the Moslem commander, their heads displayed on pikes, and their corpses nailed to crosses sent to drift across the harbor to La Valette's fortress. La Valette retaliated immediately by executing all Moslem prisoners and using their severed heads as canon shot. Today Malta's capital city bears La Valette's name.

One guesses that the religious antipathy remains. Despite its position off the north African coast, there were no mosques in Malta until the 1980s, when one -- and only one -- was allowed to open. Unlike the rest of western Europe, one sees almost no Moslem women out on the street, at least none identifiable by the wearing of headscarves. Only 2.2 percent of the populace is immigrant, the lowest proportion of any western European nation. Malta's old capital of Mdina, which bears the name of the first Arabian city ruled by Mohammed, is the only city so named outside of the Moslem world. Yet in the Maltese Mdina there are found only churches, no mosques.

Malta seems overflowing with Catholicism to a visitor from the secularized West. Each village has an annual festival on the feast of its patron saint, and seemingly not just for tourists. Half of all homes seem to have a ceramic Madonna and Child or Sacred Heart of Jesus embedded into their exterior front walls. Midway through a highway tunnel in Valetta, I find a chapel! In this man-made cave is an altar jammed with statues, icons, lights, and votive candles, which are sold in local grocery stores. On a cliff overlooking the tunnel exit is a similar chapel. On open land in the countryside is a life-size status of Joseph and the Infant Jesus, brightly lit. In the center of one traffic circle sits a tiny chapel. In the center of another, a town cross of recent origins. Built into the side of a modern warehouse is a niche holding a statue of the Blessed Virgin.

I'm told that upkeep of each of these shrines is by a local family, a local business, or the municipal government. During my week in Malta I never once saw a shrine that appeared abandoned or in ruins, but I did see a large and spanking new crucifix on the wall behind the hotel reception desk. At my hotel I found on television what I'd never seen elsewhere in Europe: Mother Angelica's EWTN, and unusually enough for modern hotels, no pornography. At five weekday Masses at Fr. Hillary's church I find the pews full. Mass and prayers are said in Maltese, a linguistic descendant of ancient Phoenician.

Malta's Catholicism is obviously not unshaken by postmodern culture. The glossy Malta Economic Update magazine is full of congratulatory stories on women who'd set aside childbearing in favor of business careers. Malta's families now average under two children apiece. Vocations are similarly depopulated. The Carmelite church in Valetta had 38 priests after World War II. Today it has three. The Augustinian church in Paceville once had seven friars, but now has two active and one retired.

Nevertheless, Malta's Catholicism seems still capable of cultural fight. In 2002 the Dutch abortion group Women on Waves sailed its floating abortion clinic, the Aurora, toward Malta. The government declared that anyone who assisted the ship was committing a criminal act, and, I was told, dispatched Navy vessels to chase it away. Intriguingly, the Aurora's website celebrates its trips to Poland and Ireland, but gives no report on the outcome of its Malta trip.

When Malta joined the European Union in 2004, it did so only after signing a protocol exempting its abortion laws from EU jurisdiction. Later that year, a UN committee suggested Malta legalize abortion in "extreme" cases. Malta's three bishops retorted that "abortion is and remains the murder of innocent persons, whatever the reason behind it," and the island remains safe for unborn babies.

In Malta I visited the Chapel of Our Lady's Return from Egypt. It is located on Malta's offshore island of Comino, which spans 743 acres uninhabited except for one farmhouse, two small hotels, and the chapel. The island has banned all automobiles. A tourist boat took me to Comino's famous Blue Lagoon of clear aqua seas and watery caves under its coastal cliffs. These provided a spectacular movie set for The Count of Monte Cristo, starring the soon-to-be famous Jim Caviezel, who later portrayed Jesus in Mel Gibson's The Passion of the Christ. But what impressed me most came later while wandering ashore. I chanced upon a secluded cove, near which stood a tiny church of windowless earthen walls topped by a triple belfry. Tacked to the door was an index card with a handwritten note reading: "Masses: Saturday 5:30, Sunday 9:30." I learned that a priest arrives here by boat every weekend to celebrate Mass.

In Amsterdam from 1581 to 1785 it was illegal for any church building to be used for Catholic worship, although Catholicism remained legal in private residences as long as it was invisible from the street. In 1661 Dutch merchant Jan Hartman converted the upper floors of his canal-front home into an ornate chapel seating 150 persons, complete with organ. Today, Hartman's house is a museum to Catholicism named "Our Lord in the Attic." It is in the middle of the Red Light district of Amsterdam. Prostitutes waved and smiled at me as I walked there midday along streets once home to public Eucharistic processions in which even the Holy Roman Emperor walked.

In Holland history has kept Catholicism in the attic for centuries. In Malta history has kept Catholicism alive, even on uninhabited islands. I think this explains more than a few of the differences I observed. Historian Hilaire Belloc once wrote that in "The re-conversion of our world to the Catholic standpoint lies the only hope for the future [of Western civilization]." Maybe I saw hope for such cultural renewal even in the heart of post-Christian Europe.

Near the Red Light district of Amsterdam, a 19th-century church stands open during the day, guarded by two ushers in suit and tie. During my visit, one rushed up the center aisle to confront a teenager kneeling at the altar rail. Urgent words were spoken, the boy removed his baseball cap, and the usher retreated. By such small steps is Western civilization renewed. Take note that the restoration began in a Catholic church.

French Clerics, Secular Press slam TLM and Trads

French clerics criticize Pope's Latin mass plans
By Tom Heneghan, Religion EditorReuters

Monday, October 23, 2006; 8:52 AM PARIS (Reuters) - Pope Benedict's expected revival of the old Latin mass has provoked protests from Roman Catholic clergy in France, a major center of the traditionalist schism the Pontiff hopes to overcome with the gesture.

(Mont St. Michel)

CR- this is the same France that has brought us Masonic revolt in the late 1700's and today has sweeping anti-Biblical, family destroying socialism/welfare and Church attendance in the single digits (estimated 15% attend "religious services", encompassing SSPX, mainline Catholics, Muslims and Protestants (1)), except among the SSPX and similar Trad groups. Further, consider this entry:However, in a 2003 poll 41% said that the existence of God was "excluded" or "unlikely".[11] 33% declared that "atheist" described them rather or very well, and 51% said they were "Christian". When questioned about their religion, 62% answered Roman Catholic, 6% Muslim, 2% Protestant, 1% Jewish, 2% "other religions" (except for Orthodox or Buddhist, which were negligible), 26% "no religion" and 1% declined to answer. A Gallup poll established that 15% of the French population attend places of worship.In a more recent Eurostat "Eurobarometer" poll, in 2005, 34% of French citizens responded that "they believe there is a God", whereas 27% answered that "they believe there is some sort of spirit or life force" and 33% that "they do not believe there is any sort of spirit, God, or life force". Anyhow, on we press….

Five bishops and 30 priests -- a considerable number in a church normally wary of open dissent -- have expressed grave concern about making this concession to ultra-conservatives who reject the reforms of the Second Vatican Council (1962-1965).

CR-Open from disent, much of the NO world is in dissent. Further, what constitutes "ultra" in conservative? Who said Trads,orthodox Catholics, SSPX, etc reject V2? Most have demonstratable distrust of J2 and want the ambiguities cleaned up. Least we ahve to say it, NO going Catholics believe the Eucharist is actually body and blood- 30%.

Unswerving loyalty to the old Latin, or Tridentine mass, often goes hand in hand with a rejection of the Vatican II reforms, which opened the church to respect for and cooperating with other faiths and switched to a modern mass conducted in local languages.

CR-so, there was no respect for "other faiths" before? Consider this entry of mine: http://catholicresistence.blogspot.com/2006/08/eternally-binding-protection-of-jews.htmlAgain, who rejects V2? We want (I am not SSPX) clarity and the abuses, by the NO fans, cleaned up and made right. The SSPX, by clinging to the TLM and Church Traditions, is growing in a country over-run by Mohammed and secularism. Again, out of the 15%-how many are NO Mass attendees?Few. Further, why should we be "open to other faiths"? Where is that anywhere? We had, argumentably, more converts pre-V2, then post-V2.

The protests printed in the Catholic press highlighted serious issues the Vatican faces if, as church sources have reported, it announces soon that priests are free to say the vintage mass as an alternative to the modern liturgy.

CR- the faithful always have, I have yet to see on J2 document that did away with the TLM. Not one Iota that prevented anyone from saying it. Vintage is good, modern often bad. The Vatican already faces "serious issues"-like bongo drums, struming guitars, clown masses, leotard wearing Gospel reading women (I have seen this 1st hand). This is the fruit of "open" V2 changes.

Demand for a return the Tridentine mass -- an austere ceremony in which the priest prays in Latin with his back to a silent congregation -- is minimal among the world's 1.1 billion Catholics.

CR- His back is not to the people, but facing Christ in the flesh in the tabernacle-what is more important? The people seeing you or Christ, the High Priest? As one that has attended many Sunday and weekly TLM, we are far from silent, as there are many responses and prayers together offered with the priest. Also, you are not sitting there quietly, but praying along WITH the priest, facing Christ. I have been to many NO Masses where the people are busy talking to each other or sitting their with the enraptured smile celebrating the Celebration. Where is the proof of minimality? We shall see indeed.

In the modern mass, the priest faces the faithful, who pray and sing in active participation with him.

CR-Again, shoddy and lazy research. The Priest faces the King, Christ. He does not have a need to face the people as the peoples priest, leading the people. Gain, ther are several times the priest faces the people in the TLM, blessing and interacting with such responses such as "Dominus Vobiscum", our out loud response "Et Cum Spiritu Tuo". Many prayers, such as the Confiteor, are recited out loud. The Readings, including Gospel is out loud, in my parish 1st in Latin, then in English. We get a sermon afterward. The Final prayers are in English. Anyone not felling they are praying the Mass, not just sitting through a pageantry are either unaccomstomed to the TLM or are lazy, as is the reporter possibly. Doubt me, http://www.angelqueen.org/mass/index.shtml

"This could create grave difficulties, especially for those who have remained loyal to Vatican II," Toulouse Bishop Robert Le Gall told the Catholic daily La Croix.

CR-So, those that go to the TLM, never outlawed by V2, are disloyal to V2? More of this idea that V2 is year 1 in the Church for the NO, New Churchers. How has SSPX, Ecclesia Dei, Una Voce, Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter, etc- not been loyal to J2? As it was pastoral and not doctrinal, how is this somehow disobidient or heretical? Again, show me the proof! This writer and others like them need the Ferrara book about EWTN. This is gross arrogance on the part of a man that is acting as part of the problem, one that is clearly not makin much impact on his society with the NO debacle. FYI-I go to NO Masses at my parish, but is closer to TLM then vast majoirty of the NO silliness and entertainment hour. Loyal to V2? Where is that in the V2 documents, that we are now "free" to scrap the 1900 yrs previous, engross ourselves in the Cumba-ya culture, syncretism and feel good blasphemies.

In an open letter, 30 young priests said Benedict, 79, should encourage them "to work in the world as it is ... rather than plunge us back into the liturgical life of another age."

CR- The new age eh? Sounds like these "young priests" (hint, hint-the NO is for the young, instead of old foggy stoggies at the TLM, though 1/2 or more of our parishs' TLM attendees are are mid 40's or less, many under 40. I am 35). Work with clown masses, women "priestesses" and largely an apathetic, lazy Catholicism? Yes, that is a plan-lets work with the weeds, instead of planting and growing wheat (Mt 13). It reminds me of a book of Prophecy by Yves DePont, where many mystics state in the later times, the people will say "let things remain as they are". How right they were. So, instead of clinging to a Mass that brought in mass converts over the years-people like Chesterton-a Mass that is unchanging and instead, work with the world that is immersed in pornography, abortion, substance abuse, gross immorality, child abuse, mass death…I could go on, but let us remember another ancient guy from "another age": If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.(John 15:19)

OPPOSITION
Dating back to 1570, the Tridentine mass was dropped in the 1960s and can now be said only with a bishop's special permission.C

CR-It was never "dropped", many continued to say it, not just the SSPX. The universal indult will take away this power trip from the bishop, making them again more subserviant to the Pope. Again, find me the V2 or other official Church document outlawing it.

But the Society of Saint Pius X (SSPX), a Swiss-based group launched by the late French Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre to oppose 1960s reforms, has demanded a blanket permission, or indult, for the Tridentine mass as a condition for its return to the church.

CR- it is supported by much of the SSPX, but the SSPX are not waiting around for permission, they-through their Bishops permission-the article writers test-HAVE been saying the TLM. The in or out of the Church status is one filing entire books.

SSPX leader Bishop Bernard Fellay and other leaders were excommunicated in 1988.

CR-again, some debate-but reading the JP2 writing, yes they were and a shame, as the NO New Churchers have fully blasphemous Mass that are more joke then sacred.

Fellay says the Vatican looks set to grant the indult soon to take the SSPX back into the church.

CR-An indult to allow something never outlawed, but bishops took away, acting as if they were themselves independent princes, not in line of hiearchy with Rome.

But he insists his million-strong movement, many in France, would continue to contest Vatican II reforms from inside the church, creating a loyal opposition keen to steer it back to earlier practices.

CR-good for them and let that happen. SSPX could be a Athanasius type movement, soo to those not in SSPX, but clinging to Tradition and possibly, the TLM. Yes, I have had negative encounters with SSPX individuals and there are, as history proves, a certain widening crack over time with division.

The Vatican has already provoked protest in Bordeaux by readmitting five SSPX priests who preformed a Tridentine mass in a church they occupied there.

CR-what, are not these protestors in line with the year 1 V2 council? Further, define "occupied". Is the Church owned by SSPX? Are they holding a gun and hold up in the Church as if a western, where the white hats are armed to the teeth and barricaded in the saloon? Odd, if this is a problem, the police were not called in by the Bishop, as anyone would with squatters or burglars.

Cardinal Jean-Pierre Ricard, Bordeaux archbishop and head of the French Bishops' Conference, has urged French Catholics to welcome rebel priests who return to the church.

CR-rebels? What are they rebelling against? Oh, that’s right-they rebel against the Council of Councils, V2. Oddly, no anathemas promulgated by V2, the self-lifed authority, the great "nano-nano". This is a slight of hand, placing the Trads in the same category as Luther, Calvin, etc. What did they rebel against in Church doctrine? V2 was pastoral, period.

"We can be charitable and welcoming but we also have to be honest," Besancon Bishop Andre Lacrampe told the daily L'Est Republicain. "I'm not ready to receive them because one cannot erase Vatican II with a stroke of a pen."

CR-why cannot V2 be "erased with a stroke of a pen"? This Bishop, writer of the article and millions of others assume V2 erased the TLM. Papa giveth, Papa taketh away, since V2 was NOT doctrinal, but pastoral. Further, who is SSPX and other Trad groups is calling for erasing V2? Who asked him to receive anyone? And if they are not in sin or outright heresy, who is he to act like Macbeth? I guess the Charasmatic, hand holding and celebration, disguised as a Mass, is ok."

There are very deep and painful theological reasons behind this schism," Angouleme Bishop Claude Dagens told the Catholic weekly La Vie. "You can't pretend that Archbishop Lefebvre's break with the church was only caused by the liturgy."

CR-Yes, the "deep and painful theological reasons" are stemming from the V2 gang of P2 Masons and long simmering Modernists, wrecking the Church and despoiling the Mass, the sanctuary, etc. Lefebvre broke over the innovators and the silliness "reforms" such as passing out the Eucharist in cardboard boxes (World Youth Day in Denver, per Ferrara), etc, etc.

Lille Archbishop Gerard Defois said some SSPX faithful were linked to far-right political movements and noted in a statement that some had "resorted to violent means to occupy churches."

CR-violence, where and when? Where are the police reports? Few doth not a organization make. Further, define "far-right". Are they the ones that want to resverse the athiestic, welfare state? Try to stop Muslims from immigrating to France, as opposed to allowing them in and then crying "help". What crimes do these "far right" people do? This is a wink and nod to the racism card and tin foil hat wearers. Maybe these far rightests remember French kings driving back Muslim invaders and fighting the Nazis, etc. So, SSPX and like minded are driveling, racists. Yes, I see and again, what is Bishop Defois doing to bring back the Faith, win over the Muslims and athiests and restore the nation to Christ? He is busy sullying traditionalists. So to, the writer joins in the abuse. Go to the NO, smile and decided yourself what you believe and chose to follow in the Church, elstwise, you may be a violent, wink-nod "far righter".

And we wonder why the SSPX and others are angry.

1.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France#Demographics

(Pic is of Pope Pius V, formulator of the modern TLM, now much maligned and attacked. Guess he to is not too with it and in line with V2)

South American Revolution Masonic

CR- While I respect Hugo Chavez for standing against the NWO-Mason inspired, he is a large supporter of Simon Bolivar and Bolivar's system, known as "Bolivarianism,"often quoting the Bible and declaring Christ was a socialist. One prays that Chavez continues to resist the NWO and USA's attempts at World Govt through NAFTA, CAFTA, Etc (the EU was formed first by selling economic trade as a crack to open). Lets pray the Chavez endorses, instead, Subsidiarity/Distributism. From a Masonic site, there is this:

(Pic is of Pope Clement XII)
SIMON BOLIVAR
by Elmer E. Rogers 33 degree
THE NEW AGE - SEPTEMBER 1948

The minds of liberty-conscious souls of North and South Americaturned to the beautiful little city, Bolivar, Missouri, on July 5,1948. There the imposing 7-foot bronze figure of Simon Bolivar,South America's Liberator and a Mason, standing on a marble base 11feet high, the gift of Venezuela, was unveiled. As was due one of his social standing, Bolivar was received in audience by the Pope.But one age-old custom at the Holy See, always expected of visitors at such audiences, is that of kissing the Pope's foot.This Bolivar refused to do, "looking the other way." Asked by the Spanish Ambassador, who had taken him to the Vatican, why he had not conformed to the custom, he curtly replied that his respect for the high office of the Pontiff should not be measured by an act of servility.

Like Thomas Jefferson, who had visited Europe, Bolivar saw much and reflected much on the causes of the despair, squalor anddegradation of the masses in Rome and the larger cities of France,Italy and Spain, where Romanism so largely prevailed(1). Having observed the same conditions in his own country, he, a few mornings after his audience with the Pope, climbed to the top of Mount Aventin with his faithful Rodriguez. There, while meditating amidst the ruins caused by the defiance of the power of aristocracy by the people, Bolivar suddenly saw a great light and, throwing his handsheavenward, is said to have taken a vow to devote his life to freeing his own land from the oppressive power of Spain. (2)

Bolivar had spent much time in Paris and there became a Mason in the York Rite and received the Scottish Rite Degrees as far as the30th Degree.

The spirit of revolt having been participated in early by General Miranda, a Mason, who had served under George Washington in the War for Independence, Bolivar was sent by the junta to England to call him back from exile to the colors of the Revolutionaries. Hereturned and headed the revolutionary forces with Bolivar as one of his generals.

Having planned these battles with General Sucre, a Mason, Bolivar went to Lima to organize a civic government and to call a constitutional convention.Intrepid, hopeful, farsighted, indomitable, and profound in his thinking for the welfare of mankind, Bolivar proclaimed, to those who had the vision to see, the following Masonic principles as his life ebbed to the shores beyond:

"All of you must work for the inestimable good of the Union; thepeople obeying the government in order to avoid anarchy; theministers praying to heaven for guidance; and the military usingits sword in defense of social guaranties. . . . If my death contributes to the end of partisanship and the consolidation of the Union, I shall be lowered in peace into my grave."
(http://www.masonicworld.com/education/files/artaug04/simon_bolivar.htm)

Comments:
1. Notice the use of "Romanism", the same term used by those of Reformed Protestantism and a few others. As someone once told me, first the Protestant Revolt, then degradation to Masonary.
2. 2 Corinthians 11 14 And no wonder: for Satan himself transformeth himself into an angel of light.

Bolivar failed to test the spirits, but thought he got some divine revealation to class warfare and division. Antoher example of the rich leading the common people to slavery through man's systems of class warfare, socialism, etc (like Attlee, Lenin, etc).

(Pope Leo XIII, the great opponent of Masons)

From a Virginia Masonic site:http://www.grandlodgeofvirginia.org/whomason.htm:

Masons (also known as Freemasons) belong to the oldest and largest fraternal organization in the world. Today, there are more than two million Freemasons in North America. Masons represent virtually every occupation and profession, yet within the Fraternity, all meet as equals. Masons come from diverse political ideologies, yet meet as friends. Masons come from varied religious beliefs and creeds, yet all believe in one God.

Many of North America's early patriots were Freemasons. Thirteen signers of the Constitution and fourteen Presidents of the United States, including George Washington, were Masons. In Canada, the Father of the Confederation, Sir John A. MacDonald, was a Mason, as were other early Canadian and American leaders.

One of the most fascinating aspects of Freemasonry is how so many men, from so many different walks of life, can meet together in peace, always conducting their affairs in harmony and friendship and calling each other "Brother."

Several Masonic Principles Are:

Faith must be the center of our lives.
All men and women are the children of God.
No one has the right to tell another person what he or she must think or believe. (1)
Each person has a responsibility to be a good citizen, obeying the law.
It is important to work to make the world a better place for all.
Honor and integrity are keys to a meaningful life.

Notable Masons:


Eddy Arnold Roy Acuff Edwin "Buzz" Aldrin Gene Autry L. Van Beethoven Irving Berlin Simon Bolivar Gutzon Borglum Ernest Borgnine Omar Bradley Richard E. Byrd DeWitt Clinton Ty Cobb George M. Cohan Davy Crockett Norm Crosby Cecil B. deMille Jack Dempsey John Diefenbaker Jimmy Doolittle Duke Ellington Sir Alexander Fleming Gerald R. Ford Henry Ford
Benjamin Franklin Clark Gable Benjamin Gilman John Glenn Arthur Godfrey Barry Goldwater John Hancock Harry Hershfield Harry Houdini Sam Houston Hubert H. Humphrey Burl Ives Andrew Jackson Al Jolson John Paul Jones Jack Kemp Rudyard Kipling Marquis de Lafayette Fiorello LaGuardia Charles Lindberg Douglas MacArthur George C.Marshall Thurgood Marshall Charles W. Mayo

William McKinley Lauritz Melchior James Monroe Wolfgang A. Mozart Arnold Palmer Dr. Norman V. Peale J.C. Penny John Pershing Eddie Rickenbacker Branch Rickey Will Rogers Theodore Roosevelt Franklin D.Roosevelt David Sarnoff Jean Sibelius Red Skelton John Philip Sousa Danny Thomas Dave Thomas Lowell Thomas Harry S. Truman George Washington Thomas J. Watson John Wayne(2)


Men Of Character And Integrity Join The Masons

Most are men who go about their jobs and professions with no hint they are Freemasons except for the way they lead their lives. Many are readily recognizable by name, face, or accomplishment. George Washington and thirteen other Presidents, eight Vice Presidents and forty-two Justices of the Supreme Court have been Masons.
(Source:http://www.grandlodgeofvirginia.org/whomason.htm)
Also, there is this site
http://www.grandlodgeofkentucky.org/
excerpt-
A belief in God
Believe in the Fatherhood of God and the Brotherhood of man
Male and at least 21 years old
Be a resident of Kentucky
Be recommended by 2 members of the Lodge
Receive a unanimous ballot for membership (3)
Finally-
http://www.americanmason.com/lightmain.ihtml?ID=8

Comments:
1. This means, obviously, the Pope, Bishops, etc. It also allows for many abuses condemened by Pope Pius IX in his Syllabus of Errors.

2. As far as the USA Founders, one wonders if some wer Mason before or after their involvement of the Revolution, in other words, did they join due to their intermingling w/Washington, Franklin, etc? Lafayette should have known better. When he joined would be interesting. Masons like to recruit from the power elite.

3 .No mention of Christ, just the usual syncretism and mingling of who knows who/what.

Papal Encyclicals Condeming Masons:


1. In Eminenti - EnglishIN EMINENTI ON FREEMASONRY PAPAL BULL OF POPE CLEMENT XII April 28, 1738 CLEMENT, BISHOP, Servant of the Servants of God to all the faithful, Salutation, and Apostolic

Benedictionhttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Clem12/c15inemengl.htm
2. Pope Leo XIIIQuella Fede (On Freemasonry) December 8, 1892 Dall'alto ... apostolico Seggio (On Freemasonry in Italy) October 15, 1890 ... Humanum Genus (On Freemasonry) April 20, 1884 Iampridem (Onhttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/index.htm

3. DALL'ALTO DELL'APOSTOLICO SEGGIOON FREEMASONRY IN ITALY DALL'ALTO DELL'APOSTOLICO SEGGIO ... designs and action of Freemasonry in Italy. Yes, this system is ... carried out wherever Freemasonry uses its impious and wickedhttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13ms1.htm

4. INIMICA VISON FREEMASONRY INIMICA VIS Encyclical of Pope Leo XIII promulgated on December 8, 1892. To the Bishops of Italy. The enemy forces, inspired by the evil spirit, ever wage war on http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13ms4.htm

5. Pope Clement XII1241 Honorius III 1216-1227 Pope Clement XII July 12, 1730 - February 6, 1740 In eminenti - Papal Bull dealing with the condemnation of Freemasonry (April 28, 1738) English /Latin http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Clem12/index.htm

6. CUSTODI DI QUELLA FEDEON FREEMASONRY CUSTODI DI QUELLA FEDE Encyclical of Pope Leo XIII promulgated on December 8, 1892. To the Italian People. Guardians of that faith to which the Christian nations http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13ms3.htm

7. QUOD APOSTOLICI MUNERISQUOD APOSTOLICI MUNERIS ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO Xlll ON SOCIALISM DECEMBER 28, 1878 To the Patriarchs, Primates, Archbishops, and Bishops of the Catholic World in Grace and Communionhttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13apost.htm

8. Praeclara Gratulationis PublicaePRAECLARA GRATULATIONIS PUBLICAE THE REUNION OF CHRISTENDOM Encyclical Letter of Pope Leo XIII June 20, 1894 To Our Venerable Brethren, all Patriarchs, Primates, Archbishops and Bishopshttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13praec.htm

9. HUMANUM GENUSHUMANUM GENUS ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO XIII ON FREEMASONRY APRIL 20, 1884 To the Patriarchs, Primates, Archbishops, and Bishops of the Catholic World in Grace and Communion with hehttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13human.htm

10. OFFICIO SANCTISSIMOON THE CHURCH IN BAVARIA OFFICIO SANCTISSIMO Encyclical of Pope Leo XIII promulgated on December 22, 1887. To Our Venerable Brethren the Archbishops and Bishops of Bavaria. Venerablehttp://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13bav.htm

Archbishop Fulton Sheen

BIOGRAPHICAL SKETCH:

Personal Data

(May 8, 1895 – December 9, 1979)
Was television's first preacher of note, hosting Life Is Worth Living in the early 1950s on the DuMont Television Network.

Sheen was born in El Paso, Illinois, the oldest of four sons of a farmer. Though he was known as Fulton, his mother's maiden name, he was baptized Peter John Sheen. As an infant, Sheen contracted tuberculosis. After the family moved to nearby Peoria, Illinois, Sheen's first role in the Catholic church was as an altar boy at St. Mary's Cathedral.

Academic

After earning high school valedictorian honors at Spalding Insititute in Peoria in 1913, Sheen was educated at St. Viator College, Bourbonnais, Illinois. Making the debating team in his freshman year, his coach called him aside the night before a major debate with the University of Notre Dame, and told him bluntly: "Sheen, you're absolutely the worst speaker I ever heard."
Sheen attended St. Paul's Seminary in Minnesota before his ordination on September 20, 1919, then followed that with further studies at The Catholic University of America in Washington, D.C..

Sheen earned a doctorate in philosophy at the Catholic University of Louvain in Belgium in 1923. While there, he became the first American ever to win the Cardinal Mercier award for the best philosophical treatise.

Sheen then taught theology at St. Edmund's College, Ware in England, In 1926, the Bishop of his hometown in Peoria asked him to take over St. Patrick's Parish. After eight months, Sheen returned to Catholic University to teach philosophy.

History

Sheen wrote the first of some 90 books in 1925, and in 1930 began a weekly Sunday night radio broadcast, The Catholic Hour

Sheen served as Auxiliary Bishop of New York from 1951 to 1965. In 1951 he also began a weekly television program on the DuMont network, Life is Worth Living. The show, scheduled for Tuesday nights at 8:00 p.m., was not expected to offer much of a challenge against ratings giants Milton Berle and Frank Sinatra, but surprisingly held its own, causing Berle to joke, "He uses old material, too". In 1952, Bishop Sheen won an Emmy Award for his efforts, accepting the acknowledgement by saying, "I feel it is time I pay tribute to my four writers. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John."

On October 2, 1979, two months before Sheen's death, Pope John Paul II visited St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York City and embraced Sheen, saying, "You have written and spoken well of the Lord Jesus Christ. You are a loyal son of the Church."

In 2002 Sheen's Cause for Canonization was officially opened, and so he is now referred to as a Servant of God.

Reruns of Sheen's various programs continue to air on the Eternal Word Television Network (EWTN) and the Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN).


AUDIO:


1. Ascension
2. Authority and Infallibility
3. Baptism
4. Birth Control
5. Body of Christ
6. Christ in the Creed
7. Communism and the Church
8. Confirmation
9. Conscience
10. Death and judgment
11. Divinity of Christ
12. Good & Evil #1
13. Good & Evil #2
14. Heaven Is Not So Far Away
15. Holy Orders
16. Holy Sacrament
17. Humanity of Christ
18. Law of Love - Total Commitment
19. Marriage Problems
20. Marriage Sacrament
21. Marriage
22. New Testament Revelation
23. Old Testament Revelation
24. Original Sin and the Angels
25. Original Sin
26. Penance
27. Peter - Vicar of Christ
28. Philosophy of Life
29. Prayer is a Dialogue
30. Purgatory
31. Revealed Truth
32. Sacrament of the Sick
33. Sanctifying Grace
34. Sex is a Mystery
35. Sin and Penance
36. Sin
37. Suffering, Death, Ressurrection
38. The Blessed Trinity
39. The Commandments - part 1
40. The Commandments - part 2
41. The Effects of Original Sin
42. The Eucharist Sacrifice
43. The Hell there is
44. The Holy Spirit
45. The Mass
46. The Mother of Jesus
47. The Sacraments
48. The World the Soul and Things

QUOTES:

If you don't behave as you believe, you will end by believing as you behave."

"Bye now, and God love you!" - Sheen's traditional closing to the program.

"Too many people get credit for being good, when they are only being passive. They are too often praised for being broadminded when they are so broadminded they can never make up their minds about anything." -Seven Words to the Cross, page 93.

"The danger today is in believing there are no sick people, there is only a sick society." -Life Is Worth Living(Second Series), page 186

"Communism is the final logic of the dehumanization of man." -Life Is Worth Living(Second Series), page 122

"Some will not look on suffering because it creates responsibility." -Those Mysterious Priests, page 66

"The principle of democracy is a recognition of the sovereign, inalienable rights of man as a gift from God, the Source of law." -Whence Come Wars, page 60

“There are not a hundred people in America who hate the Catholic Church. There are millions of people who hate what they wrongly believe to be the Catholic Church— which is, of course, quite a different thing.” -foreward to Radio Replies Vol. 1, page ix

Cause for Archbishop Fulton Sheen advancesPeoria, Jul. 25, 2006 (CNA) -

The process of canonization for Archbishop Fulton Sheen is advancing steadily. Copies of a report on an alleged miracle that took place in 1999 through the intercession of the Archbishop were signed Sunday by Roman Catholic Church officials and will be sent to the Vatican for review, reported The Journal Star. The 500-page report and supporting documents will be delivered to Rome by canon lawyer Dr. Andrea Ambrosi, postulator of the cause. The cause was officially begun in 2003. Archbishop Sheen was born in the Woodford County town of El Paso in 1895 and ordained in the Diocese of Peoria in 1919. He became widely known and respected as a teacher of the faith through his television programs in the 1950s and 1960s. He died in 1979.

The alleged miracle involves a Champaign woman, then 72 years old, who was undergoing lung surgery when a tear was discovered in her main pulmonary artery. The woman's husband told investigators he prayed for his wife's recovery invoking the archbishop. The woman is still alive and in good health.

WHY HE MADE A HOLY HOUR:

THIS GREAT SACRAMENT OF LOVE
A couple of months before his death Bishop Fulton J. Sheen was interviewed on national television. One of the questions was this:

"Bishop Sheen, you have inspired millions of people all over the world. Who inspired you? Was it a Pope?"

Bishop Sheen responded that it was not a Pope, a cardinal, another bishop, or even a priest or a nun. It was a little Chinese girl of eleven years of age. He explained that when the Communists took over China, they imprisoned a priest in his own rectory near the Church. After they locked him up in his own house, the priest was horrified to look out of his window and see the Communists proceed into the Church, where they went into the sanctuary and broke into the tabernacle. In an act of hateful desecration, they took the ciborium and threw it on the floor with all of the Sacred Hosts spilling out. The priest knew exactly how many Hosts were in the ciborium: thirty-two.

When the Communists left, they either did not notice, or didn't pay any attention to a small girl praying in the back of the Church who saw everything that had happened. That night the little girl came back. Slipping past the guard at the priest's house, she went inside the Church. There she made a holy hour of prayer, an act of love to make up for the act of hatred.

After her holy hour she went into the sanctuary, knelt down, bent over and with her tongue received Jesus in Holy Communion, (since it was not permissible for laymen to touch the Sacred Host with their hands.)

The little girl continued to come back each night to make her holy hour and receive Jesus in Holy Communion on her tongue. On the thirty-second night, after she had consumed the last and thirty-second host, she accidentally made a noise and woke the guard who was sleeping. He ran after her, caught her, and beat her to death with the butt of his rifle. This act of heroic martyrdom was witnessed by the priest as he watched grief-stricken from his bedroom window.

When Bishop Sheen heard the story he was so inspired that he promised God he would make a holy hour of prayer before Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament everyday of his life. If this frail, little child could give testimony and witness to the world concerning the real and wonderful Presence of her Savior in the Blessed Sacrament, then the Bishop was absolutely bound by all that was right and true, to do the same. His sole desire from then on was to bring the world to the burning Heart of Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament.

The little girl showed the Bishop what true courage and zeal really is; how faith could overcome all fear, how true love for Jesus in the Eucharist must transcend life itself. What is hidden in the Sacred Host is the glory of His love. The sun in the sky is symbolic of the Son of God in the Blessed Sacrament. This is why most monstrances are in the form of a sunburst. As the sun is the natural source of all energy, the Blessed Sacrament is the supernatural source of all grace and love. The Blessed Sacrament is JESUS, the Light of the world.

Excerpt from an article "Let the SON shine out" by Rev. Martin Lucia

*Note: Communion should never be taken in the hand. (Read more...)
If you wish to make a holy hour before the blessed Sacrament, visit this site that has a listing of all the adoration chapels in the United States: http://www.therealpresence.org/chap_fr.htm
Links to other sites:The Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist

http://www.knight.org/advent/cathen/05573a.htmThe Real Presence http://www.therealpresence.org/eucharst/euch_fr.htmMissionaries of the Blessed Sacrament Chapels http://www.acfp2000.com/index.html

O Sacrament Most Holy, O Sacrament Divine, all praise and all thanksgiving be every moment Thine!
(from http://www.tldm.org/news3/sheen.htm)

Discourse with a Reformed Protestor

Recently, I went to Reformed.org to see if I could raise interest in a debate between Reformed Theology and Catholic Faith for a apostolate I work with (I leave un-named as I enjoy me privacy).

Not surprisingly, I was immediately attacked and temporarily suspended. False Christians (not every Protestant is one), especially Calvinists love this tactic-to label you, attack and then suspend and/or boot you from the forum without allowing a rebuttal. Rather like Calvin's Police state of Geneva. I merely went to different categories and posted a honest and respectful challenge. We can see why New England was a miserable place to live pre-Revolution.

The following is the response I got from one of the posters, his response in Red, mine this time in Green:


Dear Sir:

If you are truly interested in being converted from your false religion, then I suggest that you contact Dr. James White. Here is his website where you may contact him:

http://www.aomin.org/

Because of your excessive posting of only one post on our website we have temporarily banned you from it. If you would like to discuss Papist vs Protestant theology on our site we can more than accomodate you.

However, your rude introduction to our site has caused you to be placed on hold. If you desire to continue to post, then you must promise to conduct yourself in an orderly fashion, and to discuss things theological.

Grace and Peace,

Goodwin

Might I suggest anger management, as you seem to have a lot of it. If Catholicism is false, how then to Calvin know ANYTHING about the Bible or basic theological standards. Answer, we wrote it, canonized it and he was educated in it.

As you are a Protestor, conversion to heresy for me is non-optional.

I posted-what?-8 or 9 offers to debate? That is excessive? Geesh, you may want to define on your site what is "excessive".

Thanks for admitting you are a Protestant-ie, a protestor against legitimate authority, we all know the father of that, eh!

BTW- no one of any credibility uses the slur "papist" anymore, just like I try not to call you-just your theology-a heretic and anathema.

Finally, define orderly. Is it 1 post a hour? a minute? a day? Only what you think is "orderly" per....?

You exhibit an angry arrogance I have grown accostomed to from Reformed"true" Christians.

We've debated White, ......next!!??

Dear Sir:

There is nothing "angry" about my reply to you. Are you interested in finding out why Catholicism is a false Christian religion? or, are you one of those confirmed Catholics who just like to bash Protestants with your false traditions? My hope is that you are of the former and not the latter.

John Calvin taught from the writings and sayings of Jesus and His Apostles. We commonly call this the Bible. When Roman Catholic "Traditions" contradict the Bible we (Calvin and Calvinists/Reformed) reject such teaching as false and contrary to the Word of the Living God. Consequently, the Romish Popes are not apostles of Jesus Christ because they constantly contradict the teachings of Jesus on Faith and Morals, and they constantly contradict themselves.

The sand of human opinion (i.e. the edicts of the Popes over the centuries on matters of Faith and Morals) are not the Word of God. For example:

The very Bible which you claim has been handed down to us through the Papal Church reads:"

Now the Spirit speaks expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy: having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats..."

The Papal Church is the only Church that has forbidden its priests to marry, and requires celibacy in order for one to become a priest. Such was never taught in the Bible. Marriage is good, and just, and holy, and true, and it was created by God from the very beginning for all men, Gen. 2:18. Only one in league with the "doctrines of demons" would forbid such to a person.

You are a follower of the Pope, and not Jesus Christ. Thus, the term "papist" is rightly applied to you and your religion.I will release your hold on our forum.

But, you are on probation.Grace and Peace,-

CalvinandHodge
Moderator of reformed.org

Your first paragraph states you, apparently, want to "school" me in true doctrine, but then goes on to rail against my supposed "false traditions".I guess that is not a bash, eh?

John Clavin, based on the 1500+ years prior to him, did NOT teach from theBible. Either way, from whence was his authority? And why is it all youReformed folks say "we don't follow Calvin, we follow the Bible...yada,yada.."?

By what authority do you judge what is or is not in the Bible? yourcontinuing fractures tell me that no one really knows.

The Popes contradict, huh? Name specifically when, where , how, what-etc.Further, no one in the Church uses the title "Romish"-a quient slur andone from your past, but not accurate. I am-get this one straight please-a LATIN RITE CATHOLIC. That is the name, that is what it is. There areseveral Eastern Rites in the CHurch that are not "Roman, Romish" etc.

Finally, Paul's exhortation in Corinthians is rather clear to the openminded, he states it is better not to marry for preachers of the word. Hedid not marry and preached. Christ did not marry and preached. Contrary tothe birth control loving Protestant populace, sex urges can be controlled,despite the homosexuality of Calvin (at least in his teens) and the ample supply of filthy writings by Luther-whereas he seemed to love bathroom humor and "sin all you want, just pray and believe all the more"

You Reformed folks really have a fixation on the marrying stuff, yet overlook that it is a discipline, NOT DOCTRINE!. Further, the Eastern Rite clergy (except in America) are allowed to marry and the majority do!Sooo.. if we are this great apostate church, based on your quote below, itis in one Rite only, not the others-yet we are all one big, happy Church.

If clergy not marrying to get out their uncontrolable lusts is bad to you,tell it to the Eastern Rite, the Latin Rite for the first severalcenturies, Paul, Christ...well, that is a start for ya!

As for Demons, I have seen your divisions and your invented doctrines like"essential and nonessential doctrine" to get around this. I have read thewritngs of your founders-Luther, Calvin.

I can see whom is a real Christian. You reject the doctrines, theauthority, the sacrements-that Christ and his Apostales gave the Church.You my friend are a Protestor, your father is the Devil (John 8:44). Ifyou truly followed Christ, you would heed his words (John 10:27)

We gave you the Bible, you decided to follow a self appointed Geneva dictator and recovering Sodomite

.Now, stop wasting my time. I offered for _ to debate your pastors,theologians, Seminary professors, etc-I have not the time to debate theirautomatons.

BTW-marriage was raised to be a sacrement by Christ, followed by his Church. You have been fed a dirty porridge and show your ignorance of what the Catholic Church teaches. Yours is a straw man for the weak minded to step up and tear down.


Stay tuned for more updates as I am sure they cannot take a "hint" . Paul sets forth celibacy in 1Cor Chapter 7, here is the passage from DR, w/Challoner's commentary:

Lessons relating to marriage and celibacy. Virginity is preferable to a married state.

1 Now concerning the thing whereof you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. 2 But for fear of fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. 3 Let the husband render the debt to his wife, and the wife also in like manner to the husband. 4 The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband. And in like manner the husband also hath not power of his own body, but the wife. 5 Defraud not one another, except, perhaps, by consent, for a time, that you may give yourselves to prayer; and return together again, lest Satan tempt you for your incontinency.

2 "Have his own wife"... That is, keep to his wife, which he hath. His meaning is not to exhort the unmarried to marry: on the contrary, he would have them rather continue as they are. (Ver. 7: 8.) But he speaks here to them that are already married; who must not depart from one another, but live together as they ought to do in the marriage state.

6 But I speak this by indulgence, not by commandment. 7 For I would that all men were even as myself: but every one hath his proper gift from God; one after this manner, and another after that. 8 But I say to the unmarried, and to the widows: It is good for them if they so continue, even as I. 9 But if they do not contain themselves, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to be burnt. 10 But to them that are married, not I but the Lord commandeth, that the wife depart not from her husband.

6 "By indulgence"... That is, by a condescension to your weakness. 9 "If they do not contain"... This is spoken of such as are free, and not of such as, by vow, have given their first faith to God; to whom if they will use proper means to obtain it, God will never refuse the gift of continency. Some translators have corrupted this text, by rendering it, if they cannot contain.

11 And if she depart, that she remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband. And let not the husband put away his wife. 12 For to the rest I speak, not the Lord. If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she consent to dwell with him, let him not put her away. 13 And if any woman hath a husband that believeth not, and he consent to dwell with her, let her not put away her husband. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the believing wife; and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the believing husband: otherwise your children should be unclean; but now they are holy. 15 But if the unbeliever depart, let him depart. For a brother or sister is not under servitude in such cases. But God hath called us in peace.

12 "I speak, not the Lord"... Viz., by any express commandment, or ordinance. 14 "Is sanctified"... The meaning is not, that the faith of the husband or the wife is of itself sufficient to put the unbelieving party, or their children, in the state of grace and salvation; but that it is very often an occasion of their sanctification, by bringing them to the true faith.

16 For how knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? Or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife? 17 But as the Lord hath distributed to every one, as God hath called every one, so let him walk: and so in all churches I teach. 18 Is any man called, being circumcised? let him not procure uncircumcision. Is any man called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised. 19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing: but the observance of the commandments of God. 20 Let every man abide in the same calling in which he was called.

21 Wast thou called, being a bondman? care not for it; but if thou mayest be made free, use it rather. 22 For he that is called in the Lord, being a bondman, is the freeman of the Lord. Likewise he that is called, being free, is the bondman of Christ. 23 You are bought with a price; be not made the bondslaves of men. 24 Brethren, let every man, wherein he was called, therein abide with God. 25 Now concerning virgins, I have no commandment of the Lord; but I give counsel, as having obtained mercy of the Lord, to be faithful.

26 I think therefore that this is good for the present necessity, that it is good for a man so to be. 27 Art thou bound to a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. 28 But if thou take a wife, thou hast not sinned. And if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned: nevertheless, such shall have tribulation of the flesh. But I spare you. 29 This therefore I say, brethren; the time is short; it remaineth, that they also who have wives, be as if they had none; 30 And they that weep, as though they wept not; and they that rejoice, as if they rejoiced not; and they that buy, as though they possessed not;

31 And they that use this world, as if they used it not: for the fashion of this world passeth away. 32 But I would have you to be without solicitude. He that is without a wife, is solicitous for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please God. 33 But he that is with a wife, is solicitous for the things of the world, how he may please his wife: and he is divided. 34 And the unmarried woman and the virgin thinketh on the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit. But she that is married thinketh on the things of the world, how she may please her husband. 35 And this I speak for your profit: not to cast a snare upon you; but for that which is decent, and which may give you power to attend upon the Lord, without impediment.

36 But if any man think that he seemeth dishonoured, with regard to his virgin, for that she is above the age, and it must so be: let him do what he will; he sinneth not, if she marry. 37 For he that hath determined being steadfast in his heart, having no necessity, but having power of his own will; and hath judged this in his heart, to keep his virgin, doth well. 38 Therefore, both he that giveth his virgin in marriage, doth well; and he that giveth her not, doth better. 39 A woman is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband die, she is at liberty: let her marry to whom she will; only in the Lord. 40 But more blessed shall she be, if she so remain, according to my counsel; and I think that I also have the spirit of God.

36 "Let him do what he will. He sinneth not"... The meaning is not, as libertines would have it, that persons may do what they will and not sin, provided they afterwards marry; but that the father, with regard to the giving his virgin in marriage, may do as he pleaseth; and that it will be no sin to him if she marry.



-posted 10/20/06

False Christ arises

CR- Please watch the video clips-carefully, see what is said and done. Bear in mind, the GOP loves t oview itself, aided by a complacent media, as "Christian", "Conservative" and the Party of "values".

Watch, listen and learn. As for me, I am Catholic first, American a distant 2nd and politically, I support:

By returning the nation to its Constitutional limits, we come-politically at least, the closest we can to Subsdiarity, etc. Get Govt off our backs and let the people have a chance. The CP is a means to the end, not the end. Nor do I ignore the many faults of the Constitution and America's founding on the shaky grounds of Enlightenment philospohy. But, I degress.....

Rev. Moon a false Christ and usurper of Christ. Supported by Congressman and George HW Bush. Shocking as he is crowned Emperor of the Universe, King of Earth, etc.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8364826129247149817&q=moonies(this includes Pat Boone, Beverly LaHaye, Ralph Reed, Jack Kemp and Bush)

Orrin Hatch honors Moon, the self declared Messiah:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1961946080781504816&q=moonies

See movie where in US Govt offices, with several GOP Congressman in attendance, Moon is crowned Messiah!
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5858563460160204776&q=rev+moon

Moon celebrates birthday-apparently-with GHW Bush and Barbara:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6635016828331713634&q=rev+moon

John 5 43 I am come in the name of my Father, and you receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him you will receive.

Also,

1 John 2
18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that Antichrist cometh, even now there are become many Antichrists: whereby we know that it is the last hour.

2 1 John 2
22 Who is a liar, but he who denieth that Jesus is the Christ? This is Antichrist, who denieth the Father, and the Son.

3 1 John 4
3 And every spirit that dissolveth Jesus, is not of God: and this is Antichrist, of whom you have heard that he cometh, and he is now already in the world

4 2 John 1
7 For many seducers are gone out into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh: this is a seducer and an antichrist.

What I found in My King James Bible

(Picture of St. Jerome)

For some time, I have been wanting to do a report on this. I promised several months ago to do it, especially on the FCFC site (oddly,or not, I was banned for "nonbiblical" views-after posting biblical verses supportive of the Catholic position).

After my grandfather was moved to a Veterans home to recover, we had to clean out his house, knowing he would not return as his health was declining. After a few happy months there, he passed away 2 yrs ago. He was as a ayoung child aconvert, thanks to his mother and lived a good and decent Catholic:

Eternal rest grant unto him, O Lord; and let perpetual light shine upon him. May he rest in peace. Amen.

I somehow got a hold of a KJV bible that he had. It was never opened and was in mint condition. I kept it for the archeology sections and other info. I should note that on my old site at manicfish, I posted several articles on the faulty KJV translations and shoddy work going in to make it, plus many that were quesitonable cultists. None the less, we should use it when possible against the Protestants and use it as a resource. As we shall see, the following excerpts crush the Protestant theology and support Catholicism.

The following is what I found in this copy. My words will be in blue, the qoutes from the KJV bible in red:

The copy in question is a King James Bible, printed in 1958 and copyrighted in USA. It is called the King James Memorial Bible.

Dedication:

..Queen Elizabeth of most happy memory, some thick and palpable clouds of darkness would so have overshadowed this Land, that men should have been in doubt which they were to walk;

So, the Queen, a vicious perscutor of Catholics, is "of happy memory"-a term used usually in regards to the Pope and other Catholic clergy. Elizabeth earned the term "bloody" far more than her cousin Mary. The dedication continues to laud her as a Sun, etc, etc. The clouds of darkness is a veiled reference to those coniving, evil "Papists" I am sure.

Introducing the Bible
by Huber L. Drumwright(1)

From Page 3:

The term "bible" was not used to designate the Holy Scriptures until the time of the early Church Fathers about 400 AD.

Well, so if the term was not used, where then is the word "bible" IN THE Text? Since it was not, are then we and the Protestants using an extra-biblical source? As it is not in the book, apparently so. We will also see down the road he reveals more Catholic doctrine in adverse to Protestant theology. Next time you talk to a Protestant, ask him/her where IN THE TEXT is the word "bible".

Also, if we are going to go by the Bible ALONE, what is up with these Fathers? Why are they called "fathers" as some Protestants loathe the term? What happened in 400 AD? Well, lets continue.....

During the 1200 or more years when its materials were being written, the Bible did not circulate as a single book.

Wait, then, how can we go by the Bible ALONE? Sola Scriptura falls apart as the Bible was not available to everyone to read nad decide for themselves waht is-and is not-true. Who were these surpressors of the Word then? No answer and apparently, no blame imputed to those bible-chaining papists.

It was not until the 4th century AD that all of its units were copied together in a single codex or volume.

So, what happened in the 4th century? Most Protestants deny a heirarchical Church (2), so was it a movement of the spirit, moving through all Bible belivers at once? Oops, since the Bible was no together, I guess there was no Sola Scriptura, so I guess it was some-what-joint mind control of all true beleivers. How did they all get together and where was the democratic votes to nominte these men that decided the canonicity of the books? Who took the lead in this (according to Protestants) democractic bottowm-up Church?

As the Orthodx beleive in the highest authority as a Council-and have not had one for over 1200 yrs-how did this monumental achievement happen? It goes back to the unanswered question-if Christ and/of the Apostles wanted Sola Scriptura-why did they not put the Bible together sooner? Were they slack? Why did not Christ just drop the Authorized KJV Bible down in boxes as he arose into the sky and departed (3).

Pages 4-5

It was not unitl the close of the first Christian century, at the Rabbinical Council of Jamnia (about 90 AD) that hte rest of the Old Testement was finally fixed and declared authoratative...

We, here is a stark admission that the Protestant bible was based on a Jewish rabbinical gathering. A problem-the Jewish faith was now superseded by the authority of the Church Christ established, his body (4). Now adays, many Protestants are arguin the old covenant is still in force, but that was not always the teaching of the ancient Church. First, what does Paul say is the upholder and protector of the truth?

But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth. (1Tim 3:15). So, what Church, the Church Christ established, not rabbinical judiasm, which rejected Chirst.

By the time of Jamina, the Catholic Church-the only true body of Christ, was alive, well and functioning. Judiasm was persecuting Christians both in Israel and throughout the Empire. We already had 2-3 Popes reigning. We already had the Council of Jerusalem. The Jamina Council had no authority, anymore than they do now or what some Buddhist gathering might decree. Luther, Calvin and Co. cite St. Jerome's opposition to the so-called "Apocrapha" was not scripture. One Church Father doeth not make a infallible decision make. Also, whay then did Luther and Co cling to one Father in rejecting that which they did not like, but rejected the copious writing of other Fathers, including Jerome that agreed together in the Real Presence, Authority of the Pope, etc, etc??

...(he names the many disputed books and then notes...) and doubts about their authority continued until the Council of Jamina.

Again, see above..also, note how he Capitlizes the name of the gathering, maybe its proper Englsih-I was not the best in grammer, but it makes it sound authoratative, which-for real Christians, it was not. He then continues a discourse noting the "Apocarapha" failed to gain acceptance for 2 centuries bofore Christ and 1 century AFTER Jamina. Again, as he-and Catholic history attests, the Bible was not canonized until the 4th century, so...?

He also note steh full Bible was in the Wycliff bible, Wycliff seen by many as a proto-Protestant by Protestants.

The Apocarapha were included in the Canon of the Septuagint, the translation of the Old Testement made for the Greek-speaking Jews of Aexandria. WHICH BECAME THE BIBLE OF THE EARLY CHURCH (emphesis mine); these books also appear in the Old Latin Bible, as well as the Latin Vulagate, Jerome's revision. They were carried over into the early German translation of the Latin Bible in the 14th century. (He then goes into talk about them 'APocarapha" being in the Wycliff Bible).

Well now, there we have it. The so-called Apocrapha was a part of the Early Church, in Jerome's Bible and still in the 14th century bible. So, the first Bible Luther probably had had the books as well. A great admission, but more to follow......

Both the Greek and Roman Church have ALWAYS RECOGNIZED THE APOCRAPHA AS CANONICAL (Emphesis mine). The Exclusion of these books from the Bible came as a result of the Reformation. When Luther translated the Old Testement from the Hebrew, these books were of course absent; but recognizing their presence in the Latin Bible, Luther translated them and put them in a group by themselves, between Testements.

Wow, again-a stark admission. First, that the oldest Churches, those of the East and the authoratative Body of Christ, the Catholic Church, have always recognized the canonicity of the so-called "Apocrapha". Two, that Luther-apparently on his own authority, translated the Hebrew Masoretic script-adopted at Jamina, a non-authorative council by a revoked Covenant church wihout authority, without the Body of Christ and active persecutor of the Body. Luther could not get around Jerome's Bible, apporved by Pope Damasus and his succesors. Luther put them in between Testsements? Whose authority did he do these things? HIs own, as his own "pope", that individualistic subjectivism, so the hallmark of Protestantism and society's breakdown.

There they remained in most Protestant Bibles unitl the 19th century, when publishers, led by the British and Foreign Bible Society, VOLUNTARILY (emphesis mine) began to omit them.

There we have it again, the Protestants on their own decision, apparently at a publishers level, decided to cut them completely out of scripture. Dod we hear this admission today in Protestant churches? Nope, not at all. Admitted on the FCFC site? Definately not at all. When Jack Chick states these books were a plot (haw haw haw) by Catholics to get Protestants "Catholcized", does he talk about this at al-well, we all know his multi-million dollar empire of carny literature would start to come down around him and his sad, poisonous spew, coming from the pit of his Father(see John 8:44 and John's letters in regards to the AntiChrist).

Ask again, by whose authority do they do these things?

Page 7, he continues

It was the Greek translation of the Old Testement, the Septuagint, begun in Egypt in the 3rd century BC, that the order of hte books altered. Since the SEPTUAGINT WAS THE BIBLE OF THE EARLY CHURCH (emphesis mine), it order was followed.

Again, if the Septuagint was the version of the early CHurch, then Protestants have to ask:

1. Was the early Church wrong?
2. If not, why does MY church not use the Septuagint.

Many will claim this is part of the corruption of the early Church, yet they never-ever can show definitive proof that the Church as completely and utterly destroyed. The allegations of Pope Gregory, Constantine, etc-they are undocument charges not backed up by history or any common sense. No credible historian believes them, only the under-educated masses of the fundamentalist churches. Only those in it for the profit like Chick, LaHaye, etc.

More revealing on page 8:

The writer details something that many Protestants refuse to admit, that prior to Luther, there wer many versions out there, in native languages. Going strictly from this writer, there was also:

Tynadale's Bible (1526)
Coverdale's Version (1535)
John Rogers' Bible (1537)
Geneva Bible (1560)
Bishops Bible (1568)
KJV (1611)

Also, just prior to the KJV, the Douay-Rheims (cited in this article).

Further..

At the end of the first Christian century, as we have seen, the Jewish rabbis, at the Council of Jamina, closed the canon of Hebrew books to be considered authorative.

Not to kick a dead horse, but what authority does this post-Old Testement covenant group have? Why listen to rabbis that rejected Christ and worked hard to crack down-often using the power of the State to do so? He also notes why the Jamnia COuncil adopted what it did, noting in the 3rd reason:

(3) the disputes with Christians over their interpretations of the Jewish Scriptures in preaching and writing.

Ok, sooo...the Catholics sided with their brethern from this time, the Protestants sided with the enemy of the Church and its first persecutors. Ok then, got it. He goes on to note disputed books that the Church authoratatively decided on in late 4th century.

He continues...

As far as it is known, it was the Easter letter of Archbishop Athanasius of Alexandria in 367 AD that first listed the 27 books of our New Testement as authoratative. Jerome, by his Latin translation of these same 27 books (382 AD) further established this list as canonical for hte Churches.

Well, what have we here. A bishop (ask the average Protestant where HIS bishop is-they must carry the name "bishop" per scripture, no some mealy-mouthed flopping they use to mean minister) AUTHORATATIVLY decided what was and was not scripture!! So too did Jerome, working on behalf of Pope Damasus! There then we have an authoratative Church, not a bottom up democracy that most Protestants defend and speel as the "biblical model".

It was the Catholic Church that decided the Canon. It was Holy Mother Church that decided disputes and make the decisions.




CHRONOLOGY OF THE BIBLE TRANSLATION

In this section, the writer again lays out a timeline of events, noting that the Septuagint was the Bible of the Early Church and still is with the Orthodox and Catholics. He then states that Wycliff completes teh English language Bible in 1382 (so much for the Church keeping the Bible in Latin only to keep the "people" from reading it!). He notes that the Gutenberg Bible wa an edition of the Latin Vulgate. He notes that Erasmus completed his Bible-in Greek- in 1516. He admits tha chapters and verse divisions came about long after Jamnia and the Early Fathers, by Catholics.

SUMMARY

So, it was the Protestants that sided with the Jews and against the Early Church. They looked to an authoratative source-the post OT covenant Jews. They rejected the Body of Christ and considred Christ a liar that "the gates of Hell shall not prevail".

Thanks to the writer of this part of my KJV Bible, for he makes a good case for Holy Mother the Church. In order to turn this off, you have to accept the Revolt of Luther, Calvin, et al. They proclaimed loudly Non Servium!

Something to note-from one of the books cut out and thrown away by the Protestants (read and and you will see why):

And when they had joined battle, it happened that a few of the Jews were slain. 35 But Dositheus, a horseman, one of Bacenor's band, a valiant man, took hold of Gorgias: and when he would have taken him alive, a certain horseman of the Thracians came upon him, and cut off his shoulder: and so Gorgias escaped to Maresa.

36 But when they that were with Esdrin had fought long, and were weary, Judas called upon the Lord to be their helper, and leader of the battle: 37 Then beginning in his own language, and singing hymns with a loud voice, he put Gorgias' soldiers to flight. 38 So Judas having gathered together his army, came into the city Odollam: and when the seventh day came, they purified themselves according to the custom, and kept the sabbath in the place. 39 And the day following Judas cam with his company, to take away the bodies of them that were slain, and to bury them with their kinsmen, in the sepulchres of their fathers. 40 And they found under the coats of the slain some of the donaries of the idols of Jamnia, which the law forbiddeth to the Jews: so that all plainly saw, that for this cause they were slain.

41 Then they all blessed the just judgment of the Lord, who had discovered the things that were hidden. 42 And so betaking themselves to prayers, they besought him, that the sin which had been committed might be forgotten. But the most valiant Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forasmuch as they saw before their eyes what had happened, because of the sins of those that were slain. 43 And making a gathering, he sent twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection, 44 (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,) 45 And because he considered that they who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them (5).

We see now the connection? Not only was this book rejected for its obvious reference to Purgatory, but the slain were killed due to the fact they carried idols of Jamnia! The false church of Judiasm met there, decided the Masoretic text and this was adopted by the Protestants-in opposition to the Early Church, the Catholic Church. A coincidence? I think, probably not.


Notes:
1. Drumwright is a deceased member of the faculty at SouthWestern Baptist Theological Seminary
http://www.dtl.org/versions/misc/translators.htm
2. Good refute:http://www.scripturecatholic.com/the_church.html
3. Lk 24:51-53
4. Col 1:24; Eph 1:23, 5:23;
5. 2nd Mach :36-45




(picture is of the DR Version Bible, the most authoratative and accurate Bible-I use this as my official bible and the RSV-CE edition for study and highlighting, etc)